Russia Warns Norway on Hosting US Marines

Discussion in 'Europe' started by Pathfinder, Jun 24, 2017.

Share This Page

  1. Pathfinder

    Pathfinder Lieutenant Colonel

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2015
    Messages:
    1,436
    Likes Received:
    2,480
    Location:
    United-States
    [​IMG]

    MOSCOW — Russia has told Norway that the extension of a U.S. military deployment in the country will hit diplomatic ties.

    The Russian Embassy in Norway warned on its Facebook page Saturday that the move could "escalate tensions and lead to destabilization of the situation in the northern region." It said "this step contradicts Norwegian policy of not deploying foreign military."

    Norway announced this week that 330 U.S. Marines will remain in the country until the end of 2018, a year longer than was originally planned. The U.S. force arrived in January and is based near the western city of Trondheim, 900 miles (1,450 kilometers) from the Russian border.

    Russia and members of NATO have accused each other of ramping up tensions in recent years with increased military activity by both sides.

    https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/articles/russia-warns-norway-that-hosting-us-marines-will-hurt-ties
     
  2. Technofox

    Technofox That Norwegian girl Staff Member Ret. Military Developer

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2015
    Messages:
    900
    Likes Received:
    3,203
    Occupation:
    Professional "Doer" of "Things"
    Location:
    Norway
    Hobby:
    Being a geek
    How about engaging Norway on a bilateral basis? Your economy isn't exactly the pinnacle of strength right now Russia and we're always happy to do business with another people's. We've already invested in Russian agricultural and energy sectors, if you want things to calm down on the military front maybe start cooperating more on the economic front. It works, it really does.

    l1050310.jpg

    But no. Instead you behave like North Korea and threaten everyone who doesn't put up with your tantrums. But hey, we've only been doing this for the past 60 years, so it's not like this is anything new. Threaten away Russia and when you're ready to put on your big boy pants and act like an adult, we'll be ready to talk.

    In the meantime, it's a pleasure to have you here boys and I hope you're enjoying your stay.

    [​IMG]
     
    YarS likes this.
  3. YarS

    YarS Lieutenant Colonel

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2016
    Messages:
    1,272
    Likes Received:
    1,015
    Location:
    Russian-Federation
    Hobby:
    Wh40k, Battletech
    Friends, of course, you can accept more american soldiers, or build Globus III radar on Vardø island, but you should understand simple thing - for any action there are our counteraction. From military point of view - it's just a preparing for sudden attack, but we shall attack first. For Norway it mean few more warheads on her territory.
    What's about economic?
    If you are not independent military, you are not independent politically and economically. Yanks will force you not to do business with "evil Russians", and we shall lost our money.
     
  4. YarS

    YarS Lieutenant Colonel

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2016
    Messages:
    1,272
    Likes Received:
    1,015
    Location:
    Russian-Federation
    Hobby:
    Wh40k, Battletech
    Girl, we like to do business with anybody, but Westies can not play fairly. Some kinds of sanctions, antidempings, "judjments". So, we are not very interested in such "business partners"

    Anything can be doing in the last time. One of your threats will be last, you know.

    Do you like Kipling?
    "Without thy order we cannot stir foot or hand, O Kaa!"

    "Good! Come all one pace nearer to me."

    The lines of the monkeys swayed forward helplessly, and Baloo and Bagheera took one stiff step forward with them.

    "Nearer!" hissed Kaa, and they all moved again"
     
  5. Technofox

    Technofox That Norwegian girl Staff Member Ret. Military Developer

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2015
    Messages:
    900
    Likes Received:
    3,203
    Occupation:
    Professional "Doer" of "Things"
    Location:
    Norway
    Hobby:
    Being a geek
    Sanctions didn't happen in a vacuum, nor were they void of reciprocity. At some point if Russia is genuine about improving its relations with other nation it'll have to stop with the North Korean-esque threats of punitive actions for things it doesn't like, and start trying to engage other countries to reduce tensions and improve ties. Being threatening is exactly what got Russia into this situation in the first place.

    Engagement on an economic front helps reduce tensions. We see it in the SCS with Japan and China, two long-time bitter rivals, we see it in Europe too with Turkey and Russia coming together recently to forge energy ties. And we saw it with Norway and Russia post-Soviet collapse when the two sides expanded their energy and agricultural ties and even their military-to-military ties.

    [​IMG]

    At some point however, if Russia is seriously interested in seeing the Americans leave it has to approach Europe and work something out. Again, it's the North Korea quandary. The US and South Korea have made overtures, the North threats and has taken advantage of their tension reducing initiatives. In good faith, come to Brussels or Oslo and talk with the leadership in Europe to improve ties.

    Sometimes you need to make the first move. It shows a genuine desire to make things better and frankly, I'd rather see a productive economic and political relationship with Russia then the continued antagonistic one that's been ongoing since the late 1940s, but Europe's made its pitch and now you'll have to make one too.

    Until then we'll do what's necessary to ensure your threats stay as empty as we take them.

    Anti-dumping measures aren't really a counteraction to Russian policy though, more so to unfair business practices and are typically enacted or probed when a country subsidizes the production of something like steel to drive down production costs artificially to improve export chances. That harms domestic producers and makes them unable to be competitive in the market. Europe levies anti-dumping measures against the US too, btw.

    China and Russia have a fair number of state-managed or state-run companies which receive subsidization from their respective governments (and sometimes prop up flagging or zombie companies) and that's what garners the ire of the EU's lawyers. In Europe and North America state-run businesses don't exist because by and large the government is barred from business holdings. However, we do see a form of subsidization in the form of grants given to defence companies, so it's not as if we're entirely guiltless either. That said, European and North American defence companies typically don't use their state backing to gain an unfair advantage in China or Russia, just the countries around them, and you can't impose anti-dumping tariffs on business targeting your neighbor.

    http://www.antidumpingpublishing.com/category/eu-ad-news/

    http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/docs/2015/october/tradoc_153920.def.en.L284-2015.pdf

    One or one-hundred, it doesn't matter. We've been under the gun since the end of WWII and this antagonistic relationship has had worse ups and downs. This recently upswing in tensions will dissipate too and no one around here takes rhetoric seriously because it's all puff.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2017
    SMSpiff and YarS like this.
  6. YarS

    YarS Lieutenant Colonel

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2016
    Messages:
    1,272
    Likes Received:
    1,015
    Location:
    Russian-Federation
    Hobby:
    Wh40k, Battletech
    I'm not expert in Yanks-psyhology, but I know - this sanctions are result only of economic reasons. "Magnitskiy Akt", "LGBT-rights", "Pussy Riot", "Crymea", "Donbass", "murdering of whales" - does not matter. First target is Europe and it's economical survival.

    It is much better to be "North Korea" that "Lybia" or "Norway".

    May be. But we preffer to get money for "reducing tensions" that waste it. "Even one penny for useless thing is too much". And yes, invest money in Europe&USA project is not clever - they will stealth our money for "Rights of LGBT", or "rights of Neo-Nazi" or "Rights of whales" or something else. No trust - no business.




    Yanks by themselves are harmless, and their invade in Norway is not our business. It's a sign, that they
    a) wanna strangle EU economic by making bad to Norway oil production.
    b) wanna start war with Russia by sudden strike.
    Of course, we shall react, but we fight with reasons, not consequences.

    That's for me, we already did too much of "first moves".



    Ha! If our treats are "empty", why Norway invite US-soldiers?


    For little Norway it's matter.

    They told same things before WWI and WWII. Every peaceful time finish (earlier or later).
     
  7. SMSpiff

    SMSpiff Officer Candidate

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    9
    Location:
    United-States
    An important point to remember about such threats: making threats because of the deployment of defensive forces only proves the deployment of such forces to be reasonable.
     
    Technofox likes this.
  8. BlueHawk

    BlueHawk Captain

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2017
    Messages:
    426
    Likes Received:
    428
    Location:
    Norway
    Hobby:
    Sport
    @SMSpiff

    He doesn't understand that. When you dig in deeper. You will see something else. After that it make not sense to have a good conversation. If you try to teach away he will not be able to see. And if he see it he is not allowed. So what would u do then?
     
  9. Technofox

    Technofox That Norwegian girl Staff Member Ret. Military Developer

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2015
    Messages:
    900
    Likes Received:
    3,203
    Occupation:
    Professional "Doer" of "Things"
    Location:
    Norway
    Hobby:
    Being a geek
    It also has to be said that this isn't the first instance of the USMC being deployed to Norway either. The Marines have pre-positioned equipment in Norway for decades and soldiers frequent Norwegian soil for NATO and Nordic-led exercises such as Cold Response, Arctic Challenge Exercise and Joint Viking.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The 330 currently in Norway aren't here as part of a permanently deployed force, but rather to train in cold weather as is relevant to much of Europe, Northern Europe especially and is relevant now that Russia improves its overall capabilities in the Arctic. Extending their rotation still doesn't equate a permanent force.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    It's also worth noting that the UK's Royal Marines are actually around more often then the United States' Marine Corps is, but we don't usually here anything from the Russian military or government about them being around.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Russia's just trying to maximize a bit of hesitance with Europe towards the US at the moment and its commitment to NATO under the Trump Administration to wedge Norway from the US, if even a little, especially as Norway's election campaign begins. The Russians didn't really say much when the USMC first arrived at Værnes curiously.
     
    SMSpiff likes this.
  10. SMSpiff

    SMSpiff Officer Candidate

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    9
    Location:
    United-States
    Great pictures, love it. Bring more than just Marines next time, I want to come. :norwegian:

    Even adding up all the American units being sent or extended to neighbors of Russia, the total doesn't come up to anything terribly threatening. Norway isn't some microscopic country where 330 people add up to a monumental shift in force.
     
    Technofox likes this.
Loading...